Another 10.4 shortfall.

[eddiesverus]

I must be stupid, I still haven't been able to get more than 4 graphs at a time. Sometimes you get single column of of data and sometimes you get two columns, can you change this too ?

No you can't, I agree on this to select one or two column rows of data I hate it when a singal column is diplayed. When veiwing data on one row of data, data is very slow to display like if it freezes then suddenly start working and you can only view or graph 4 pids. you can select more and graph them all pids but only 4 will be viewable, you then need to select graph view to view them all, very time consuming, I hate it this so much that I just exit out and use my other tools to get data correctly displayed.

Please Snappy work on this and give us back the old UI display options.

[Wheel]

Thanks Wheel.

I thought it was just me. I did have several dozen saved presets that I had created with explicit instructions that were often quite detailed. You could add as much comments as you wanted and still can but with the current UI the comments are not visable prior to loading the preset as they were before. They are nowhere to be found once the meter/labscope loads either.

here are a couple pf examples with the current UI?
[ATTACH]6120[/ATTACH]

Note that there are no details or comments. I know this format is better for navigation with your fingers that is why the icon based UI I guess.

Here I saved a "Preset Example" showing the entry of comments during the save process:[ATTACH]6121[/ATTACH]
to be viewed later to save time in the future.

This feature is great for component testing or system tests that are not in the CTM or are not correct. This greatly helps other techs who are not as lab scope friendly make the best use of the tool. The data manager should have the ability to view the saved files/presets as icon based or with details as the windows file manager does. then you could sort the saved files as before by date. Let's not push for thumbnails as this would most likely tax the limited resources.

Oh and by the way I really miss this feature:[ATTACH]6122[/ATTACH]

On another note I really like the current lab scope operation. It is quite good and so far have not had issues. I see that the ability to view a graphed dutycycled signal now has the ability to switch the trigger slope thus interpreting the reading correctly as the manufacturer expected. The old 10.2 meter had the ability but it did not work to switch the slope. The meter would always read the low voltage as the "on" time instead of the high voltage.

Here's my assessment of presets:
Clipboard01.jpg

Clipboard02.jpg

I need to correct a mistake on my part here. The previous screen shot is how things are presented from shopstream or data manager, NOT
from the actual selection menu, as shown below:
20110430-1943-1.jpg
20110430-1945-1.jpg
20110430-1947-1.jpg
I apologize for thr mistake.

[phill57]

Scope and Multimeter pretsets and other things

Thanks Wheel.

That is exactly what I was referring to. I had created many user preset configurations with details on how and where to connect and they are lost now. Just the other day I had to do ignition tests on a Kia Sportage. The ignition coils are not easily accessible so I do primary tests at the ECM. I had identified the two ignition coil control circuits by pin number and wire color at the ECM. Set up dual trace lab scope with proper trigger level, slope, amplitude and sweep settings. I had to look up the pin numbers again.

On another note the screen captures are automatically saved by the date as the file name. Since the current UI provides you with no options on sorting the files, it automatically sorts them oldest to newest, you will have to scroll forever to get to the most recent files. I used to take screen captures for printing or viewing later. Now I have to use SSC or I will wear out my screen saver scrolling. With the old UI, (10.2) you could sort via the date created. I would often review the date a vehicle record was created and then look for screen captures that were created at the same time/date for reference.

I hope Snap-On hears us.

[Wheel]

Thanks Wheel.

That is exactly what I was referring to. I had created many user preset configurations with details on how and where to connect and they are lost now. Just the other day I had to do ignition tests on a Kia Sportage. The ignition coils are not easily accessible so I do primary tests at the ECM. I had identified the two ignition coil control circuits by pin number and wire color at the ECM. Set up dual trace lab scope with proper trigger level, slope, amplitude and sweep settings. I had to look up the pin numbers again.

On another note the screen captures are automatically saved by the date as the file name. Since the current UI provides you with no options on sorting the files, it automatically sorts them oldest to newest, you will have to scroll forever to get to the most recent files. I used to take screen captures for printing or viewing later. Now I have to use SSC or I will wear out my screen saver scrolling. With the old UI, (10.2) you could sort via the date created. I would often review the date a vehicle record was created and then look for screen captures that were created at the same time/date for reference.

I hope Snap-On hears us.

You're welcome.
I think it necessary to do these side by side comparisons using actual screens and show, not just tell Snap On what we need and carefully explain why in hopes they will come to understand why the old interface just works better than Atlas in the real world, because they don't have to deal with it like we do.
A picture is worth more than a thousand words here.
In the process, hopefully, this will also show newcomers to the Verus
who have never used the old interface enough to appreciate it exactly what they are missing so they will also stand with us.
We all probably need to collaborate and do this for each feature we want restored. Very few, if any of us have access to both interfaces or this would be so much easier. For this reason, I hope you don't mind me stealing your picture and doctoring it up a bit.
This new way of doing the presets not only majorly sucks, but almost totally defeats the convenience of having
these presets. By trying to make the tool more user - friendly one way,
they have totally destroyed the user - friendliness in so many other ways. The less user - friendly a tool is, the less likely one is to use it,
even if it is a powerful tool. Nobody wants to buy a tool that nobody wants to use, especially if it has Verus' price tag. Last time I checked
the poll I set up it was better than 3 to 1 in favor of the old interface.

[SnapOnKid]

Thanks for the pictures Wheel. I never got to use the 10.2 software but some of the features in it are deffinitally worth having restored in the new UI.

Snap On is listening. Thats why they gave us this forum. They have already said they can not go back wards to the old interface. I wish they could better explain there reasoning on this forum but aparently they don't want to share that information.

Hopefully some of the needed features will get restored in the 11.4 update. We all know there is alot of potential in this tool so I guess will have to see what they decide to do with the feed back we have given them.

[Wheel]

One big reason I do these screens is for guys just like you who don't
know from first hand experience what you are missing, so you can judge for yourself if these lost features will help you. And if so, you can add your voice to ours in asking for the return of those you want.
Snap On may be listening, and they can indeed go back to the old way,
they just won't. We may have to convince them otherwise if they can't
restore ALL the old features from the original interface that made Verus
the best aftermarket scan tool ever built, and make them work properly
by 11.4. That and make it as stable as it once was.

[Wheel]

Here's my assessment of presets:
[ATTACH]6450[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH]6451[/ATTACH]

I need to correct a mistake on my part here. The previous screen shot is how things are presented from shopstream or data manager, NOT
from the actual selection menu, as shown below:
[ATTACH]6589[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH]6590[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH]6591[/ATTACH]
I apologize for thr mistake.

I had to make a correction to the above quoted post concerning the scope presets. I hope the correction will prove useful.

[66superduty]

i cant stand the thought that so much has changed in the last year that i am considering selling my verus and getting something else, but i would gladly buy all the snap-on updates if they would go back to what i bought in the 1st place

[Wheel]

i cant stand the thought that so much has changed in the last year that i am considering selling my verus and getting something else, but i would gladly buy all the snap-on updates if they would go back to what i bought in the 1st place

You're not alone. The way I see it they have made a choice between
their loyal customer base and Atlas, and you know who lost.
I will reserve final judgment on this until 11.4, and then if what we lost isn't restored and working properly, then the only way they will get any further
diagnostic dollars of mine is if they would then be willing to scrap Atlas and go back to what worked by 12.2 or 4. If they don't deliver by then, then I'm
done with them no matter what they come up with.
I stand ready to spend a few grand with them if they get it right.

[SnapOnKid]

You're not alone. The way I see it they have made a choice between
their loyal customer base and Atlas, and you know who lost.
I will reserve final judgment on this until 11.4, and then if what we lost isn't restored and working properly, then the only way they will get any further
diagnostic dollars of mine is if they would then be willing to scrap Atlas and go back to what worked by 12.2 or 4. If they don't deliver by then, then I'm
done with them no matter what they come up with.
I stand ready to spend a few grand with them if they get it right.

I understand your frustration. I know they are listening because I was contacted about some of the changes That I posted up asking for, for all of us. Hopefully we will see some changes. I am not sure what is possible before the release of 11.4. I know there always working on new data but hopefully there putting some focus on the Atlas U.I. to make it better like some of the features it had before.

I personally wish as a sign of good faith some one from Snap On could post something up about how and why The UI was changed so that every one including the end user could better understand why it was changed.

[gentz]

I understand your frustration. I know they are listening because I was contacted about some of the changes That I posted up asking for, for all of us. Hopefully we will see some changes. I am not sure what is possible before the release of 11.4. I know there always working on new data but hopefully there putting some focus on the Atlas U.I. to make it better like some of the features it had before.

I personally wish as a sign of good faith some one from Snap On could post something up about how and why The UI was changed so that every one including the end user could better understand why it was changed.

See thats one of the problems SnapOnKid. "hopefully we will see some changes" . We go out, buy the new update 11.4 and bam nothing same ole...
then lets see if on 12.2, we buy it and nothing....its a never ending game and SO keeps getting their pockets full...

[Wheel]

See thats one of the problems SnapOnKid. "hopefully we will see some changes" . We go out, buy the new update 11.4 and bam nothing same ole...
then lets see if on 12.2, we buy it and nothing....its a never ending game and SO keeps getting their pockets full...

This is precisely why I refuse to buy anything diagnostic from Snap On unless / until they clean this mess up. Otherwise there is no incentive for them to change.

[SnapOnKid]

Like I said I understand. My unit had 10.4 on it and 11.2 was free as part of the package I bought since it was close the release date. We have a solus pro with 10.4 at the shop and the boss won't buy an update until the early Honda Evap and the VTM4 coverage gets added. Can't say I blame him. Other lesser tools have the coverage..

[Snafu]

I was told today by my dealer that there is no way they are going back to 10.2, Snap-on went to the Atlas program to allow for the wireless module and that the wireless module will become a J2534 interface as well.

For some reason 10.2 was not compatible with the wireless blue tooth so they had to go to the Atlas program in order to give us the wireless. (that everyone was asking for)

I am only disappointed in the fact that the pid screen and graphing screen has been changed. I really have no other problems with the Atlas program other than this.

I really really hope that Snap-on changes the scrolling pid screen and graphing screen back to the 10.2 design or something very similar.

The scrolling really sucks...fingers to big and the stylist really does not improve things a whole lot.

[Wheel]

I understand your frustration. I know they are listening because I was contacted about some of the changes That I posted up asking for, for all of us. Hopefully we will see some changes. I am not sure what is possible before the release of 11.4. I know there always working on new data but hopefully there putting some focus on the Atlas U.I. to make it better like some of the features it had before.

I personally wish as a sign of good faith some one from Snap On could post something up about how and why The UI was changed so that every one including the end user could better understand why it was changed.

I really don't expect much before 11.4, but if they had incremental patches as any features are restored it would beat nothing and be a sign of good faith.
New data is always a priority, but even if the Verus had full OE coverage on all makes, it wouldn't be of much use if it wasn't on a stable, user-
friendly platform, because an instrument that is a pain to use collects dust no matter how good it is. It's just human nature to avoid a hassle.
The fact that so many are hanging around asking Snap On to fix this tool
rather than going elsewhere for their scanning needs is a testament to how good the Verus once was. But if it is going to be too much of a hassle to get them to fix this, then people will eventually go elsewhere,
including die - hard Snap On supporters eventually.

I don't know all their reasoning for changing, but any benefit they have in mind is FAR outweighed by the damage done. If they had some really good reasoning, then hearing at least some of it might make a huge difference in the patience factor of their customers.