This needs to be corrected

[Crusty]

I just took a peek at a couple of "fixes" in the Suretrack forum

THIS information NEEDS TO BE SET STRAIGHT-!!!

http://askatech.com/AskATechLive/Dashboard/Dashboard.aspx?solutionId=18546503&bucketType=Solutions&idfromSource=18546503&sourceName=EbiWiki&latestControl=false&changeSelection=true

The supposed "best answer" is stating that .26 amps isn't a problem and that it needs to be .350-amps to be considered a problem-!!!

YIKES-!! 0.260 (.26) IS OVER A QUARTER OF AN AMP-!!!
0.350-amps is almost 1/3 of an amp-!!

YA, ya, I know it's just a misplacement of a decimal point BUT DECIMAL POINTS ARE IMPORTANT-!!!

Just like on a pay cheque.... it doesn't matter how many zeros are on it-!!!
It's where the DECIMAL POINT is located that's important-!!

I've BITCHED in some other forums about decimal point placement (or missing) but they really ARE important-!!

There is a very OLD saying.....

THE DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS-!!!!

Someone else reading this "fix" is NOT going to get the correct information.

(hope the link works)
2000 Grand Marquis, Battery going dead.

[Joe Rappa]

I'll back Crusty up on this one. 1/4 Amp draw will kill a marginal battery overnight.
Most manufacturers don't publish parasitic draw specs, so many guys look elsewhere for the info. If I see anything over 100 mA I'm chasing a problem. Even less on older cars that don't have 20 processors.

Joe

[Nick_Taylor]

I will try and contact the author of the best answer to see if they want me to edit their answer.

[Nick_Taylor]

By the way, I don't have a way to change the best answer section of the original post.

[Crusty]

Hey Nick.
Just a suggestion in these type of situations.... What about an "Administrators Note" and adding a post regarding decimal places and amperes versus milliamps, advising people to do their due diligence and double check their meter readings-??

Thanks for the support Joe. Personally even 100-ma draw/drain seems too high. Lots of modules draw a ton less than they used to draw. Recent GM vehicles state that anything above 35-milliamps is abnormal and most vehicles are in the 8 to 12 milliamp range after everything shuts down. I would be surprised if any production vehicle had a normal draw/drain of 100, but I haven't measured any Euro vehicles recently.
Maybe Steve6911 has a more recent expected value for those-??

[Joe Rappa]

In my experience you will find some Cadillacs that high. I've been wrong in the past though, so I wouldn't argue about the number bring lower.
Joe

[David Green]

I'll back Crusty up on this one. 1/4 Amp draw will kill a marginal battery overnight.
Most manufacturers don't publish parasitic draw specs, so many guys look elsewhere for the info. If I see anything over 100 mA I'm chasing a problem. Even less on older cars that don't have 20 processors.

Joe

Joe, I have some tables of data from Power Probe which are widely available on the internet, they are referring to volt drop and parasitic draw specs I think

If you could just clarify for me that parasitic draw is the manufacturer maximum current flow in mA's please!!

The tables say;

In the first vertical column live data is measured in mV's, then referring to the horizontal columns of data select the fuse rating to which the circuit is being tested, then move across to the fused circuit to be tested from the live mV's and down the column until you read off the parasitic draw.

So just to clarify, is the parasitic draw the maximum circuit current flow in milli amps that the manufacturer recommends for a given volt drop in a circuit?

Thanks for any replies

David

[Joe Rappa]

I'm not certain if I am answering your question, but parasitic draw is the current flow from the battery when all systems are powered down in the vehicle. the higher the draw, the faster the battery will die from being discharged.

High parasitic draw can come from simple stuff, like a glove box light staying lit, or from ones that can trickier to find.

My latest one was the radio amplifier in a Mustang not powering off when they key was turned off. It would drain the battery overnight.

Joe

[maven]

Hey Nick.
Just a suggestion in these type of situations.... What about an "Administrators Note" and adding a post regarding decimal places and amperes versus milliamps, advising people to do their due diligence and double check their meter readings-??

Thanks for the support Joe. Personally even 100-ma draw/drain seems too high. Lots of modules draw a ton less than they used to draw. Recent GM vehicles state that anything above 35-milliamps is abnormal and most vehicles are in the 8 to 12 milliamp range after everything shuts down. I would be surprised if any production vehicle had a normal draw/drain of 100, but I haven't measured any Euro vehicles recently.
Maybe Steve6911 has a more recent expected value for those-??

Most modern GM diagnostic info tells you a sustained 35mA draw is maximum acceptable.

100mA would absolutely be excessive and 260mA is enough to kill a fully charged healthy 60AH battery stone dead in less than 10 days.

AH rating / (vehicle draw in amps)= number of hours to drop battery to 10,5V

[Crusty]

Most modern GM diagnostic info tells you a sustained 35mA draw is maximum acceptable.

100mA would absolutely be excessive and 260mA is enough to kill a fully charged healthy 60AH battery stone dead in less than 10 days.

AH rating / (vehicle draw in amps)= number of hours to drop battery to 10,5V

I agree Maven
I looked up some documentation today.
100-ma is too high-!!

The "procedure" using "authorized" equipment here says to look for 30-ma (this is from a 2010 Cadillac BTW)

Even if it was a good healthy battery fully charged it would only last 8 days.

[Joe Rappa]

Cool. 35mA it is. Some language in there for aftermarket alarm systems, car starters and other accessories might be helpful. Hopefully the original poster will update the thread.

Joe

[Crusty]

Cool. 35mA it is. Some language in there for aftermarket alarm systems, car starters and other accessories might be helpful. Hopefully the original poster will update the thread.

Joe

You're right Joe.
I've seen lots of problems with aftermarket remote start systems, and aftermarket alarms, and sometimes accessories such as plug-in cell phone chargers and global positioning and direction finders left plugged in.

There were also some things noted such as the heater/AC module pulling about 40-ma for up to three hours after shut down. Another was that if the Remote Keyless Entry (RKE) received a signal it could momentarily spike up to 100-ma but only for a brief second. There was also a mention of the OnStar system staying awake and pulling 80-ma (??) for 48-hours but I'm not sure if that is only the first time it becomes active. I may have the 40-ma and the 80-ma mixed up for which system but they are not consistent drains.

The highest CONSISTENT parasitic draw from a properly operating factory system that I have seen was 65-ma (0.065) way back on a 1986 Buick Riviera with a Touch-Screen CRT that was the central control for the radio as well as the heater/AC, and a few other things. (yes, 1986...LOL)
Since then the microprocessors have improved to where they can still perform their function and draw less than 1-ma (that's 1/1000 of an amp or 0.001)
At that rate of power consumption even a dozen modules plugged in wouldn't even reach 15-ma.

The original post where .26 (0.260) and .35 (0.350) were mentioned is way too much for virtually ANY vehicle to sustain enough battery power to crank the engine over the next morning.

The Devil really is in the details....

[maven]

Yeah, full asleep vehicle current draws are remarkably low on a healthy car. The average is probably 12mA.(.012) The normal range is about 8-20mA(.008-.020)

pretty amazing for a vehicle that can easily have in excess of 30 or 40 modules.

[David Green]

I'm not certain if I am answering your question, but parasitic draw is the current flow from the battery when all systems are powered down in the vehicle. the higher the draw, the faster the battery will die from being discharged.

High parasitic draw can come from simple stuff, like a glove box light staying lit, or from ones that can trickier to find.

My latest one was the radio amplifier in a Mustang not powering off when they key was turned off. It would drain the battery overnight.

Joe

Thanks Joe, I am including an attachment for you to read, its the current flowing through the fuses I am asking about.

[liljoe]

That chart is for checking current flow with a loaded circuit, it uses basic electrical properties to determine current flow based on voltage drop across the fuse, this is not useful in determining current draw for low drain problems, you need to have a very substansanial current to measure this way.