I want the old 10.2 data back

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  • eddiesverus
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2008
    • 414

    I want the old 10.2 data back

    Just as in the Verus forum I want 10.2 back. I still wish to get it some of its best Data and graphing features back. The new interface is nice and is faster in some ways. but it has slowed us down in other ways. For example, when scrolling to look for a pid say SFT and LFT then I graph them. they will get moved to the top as I select one by one, I loose time in scrolling to find them. Then I look for the O2, ECT, IAT, MAF or MAP to find out why the fuel trims are out of range I will loose the graphs agian as I scroll to look for these other pids . I scroll all the way back up to view the graphs agian, its a waist of time and a big frustration to be doing this over and over. Even to custom select pids I may not view all other important pids I overlooked. What we need is to be able to lock the graphs to stay in place while scrolling the rest of the data and adjust the font text size to fit more pids on the screen. Better yet, just get the old 10.2 interface back. also like stated in other post (we need better printing) print freeze frame data, long DTC list and long data pids without wasting much paper and ink. Im hoping next update bring us back these old features. Otherwise I will be more unhappy than I already am, especialy with the S3 wireless issues in my other posts.
    Hard Work, commitment, Honesty and not giving up is what Makes us better Tech's
  • Crusty
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2007
    • 2450

    #2
    Originally posted by eddiesverus
    Just as in the Verus forum I want 10.2 back. I still wish to get it some of its best Data and graphing features back. The new interface is nice and is faster in some ways. but it has slowed us down in other ways. For example, when scrolling to look for a pid say SFT and LFT then I graph them. they will get moved to the top as I select one by one, I loose time in scrolling to find them. Then I look for the O2, ECT, IAT, MAF or MAP to find out why the fuel trims are out of range I will loose the graphs agian as I scroll to look for these other pids . I scroll all the way back up to view the graphs agian, its a waist of time and a big frustration to be doing this over and over. Even to custom select pids I may not view all other important pids I overlooked. What we need is to be able to lock the graphs to stay in place while scrolling the rest of the data and adjust the font text size to fit more pids on the screen. Better yet, just get the old 10.2 interface back. also like stated in other post (we need better printing) print freeze frame data, long DTC list and long data pids without wasting much paper and ink. Im hoping next update bring us back these old features. Otherwise I will be more unhappy than I already am, especialy with the S3 wireless issues in my other posts.
    If the "EDIT" list worked, wouldn't that provide the capability you described?

    Comment

    • Warren97053
      Junior Member
      • May 2013
      • 7

      #3
      I don't care how they want to spin it, the new software took too much good stuff away. Verus Pro helped a little but Graphing sucks. Scrolling is a joke. Someone thought Verus should be more like a phone ap or something and screwed it up. At least VIN# is back in Verus pro. But graphing and printing graphs is messed up. The techs in my shop use the Modis and don't like when they're stuck using the Verus Pro. This is not a game. I make my living with these tools and don't like when I pay for something that goes backwards.

      so, let me tell you how I really feel...

      Comment

      • Warren97053
        Junior Member
        • May 2013
        • 7

        #4
        some one needs to let snap on know that just because you don't have a lot people complaining doesn't mean they're all happy out there. Who does the programming people get their direction from? It's time someone told them that this costly piece of equipment is for diagnosing cars and selling the time and repairs to the customer. Upgrades aren't supposed to go backward. Don't need scroll need better graphing. need to be printer friendly. Yellow for trace 1, are you serious? Unless you want to paint you paper in black ink yellow shows up poorly on a white background. Who thought of that? Duh, scale and sweep don't show up with a white background... Have to use more ink and make the background at least gray. Who's working upstairs in the software dept.?

        Comment

        • Wheel
          Senior Member
          • Jul 2007
          • 719

          #5
          Originally posted by Warren97053
          I don't care how they want to spin it, the new software took too much good stuff away. Verus Pro helped a little but Graphing sucks. Scrolling is a joke. Someone thought Verus should be more like a phone ap or something and screwed it up. At least VIN# is back in Verus pro. But graphing and printing graphs is messed up. The techs in my shop use the Modis and don't like when they're stuck using the Verus Pro. This is not a game. I make my living with these tools and don't like when I pay for something that goes backwards.

          so, let me tell you how I really feel...
          We've been giving Snap On an earful on just this since 10.4 came out
          and they AREN'T listening, at least on this. I was eligible for a free software upgrade from 10.2 to 10.4 and turned it down and haven't
          upgraded since, and won't until what we lost in 10.2 is added back.
          Many have repeatedly asked for these things back to no avail.
          I thought these forums were for us to tell Snap On what we would like in the scanners. So much for that. Forum participation seems to have dwindled lately... could it be because people are finally giving up and
          seeing what the competition is now offering - some of which looks interesting.
          Maybe it's time for a youtube video on things 10.2 could do that the new software can't.
          You can expect the reputation of your business to be no better than the cheapest item or service you are willing to sell. - Wheel

          Comment

          • Crusty
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2007
            • 2450

            #6
            Originally posted by Warren97053
            I don't care how they want to spin it, the new software took too much good stuff away. Verus Pro helped a little but Graphing sucks. Scrolling is a joke. Someone thought Verus should be more like a phone ap or something and screwed it up. At least VIN# is back in Verus pro. But graphing and printing graphs is messed up. The techs in my shop use the Modis and don't like when they're stuck using the Verus Pro. This is not a game. I make my living with these tools and don't like when I pay for something that goes backwards.

            so, let me tell you how I really feel...
            OK, this is just TOO FUNNY-!!!

            "should be more like a phone ap or something and screwed it up."

            Touch screens and wifi/Bluetooth may make it more CONVENIENT but does NOTHING to enhance a repair.

            " VIN# is back in Verus pro"

            EVERY scan tool should "capture" the VIN of the vehicle it's connected to.

            "This is not a game. I make my living with these tools and don't like when I pay for something that goes backwards."

            If the people at SO had to earn THEIR paycheque with these tools, day in and day out, would THEY be happy and be able to PROPERLY test and diagnose vehicles?

            Comment

            • Crusty
              Senior Member
              • Dec 2007
              • 2450

              #7
              Originally posted by Warren97053
              some one needs to let snap on know that just because you don't have a lot people complaining doesn't mean they're all happy out there. Who does the programming people get their direction from? It's time someone told them that this costly piece of equipment is for diagnosing cars and selling the time and repairs to the customer. Upgrades aren't supposed to go backward. Don't need scroll need better graphing. need to be printer friendly. Yellow for trace 1, are you serious? Unless you want to paint you paper in black ink yellow shows up poorly on a white background. Who thought of that? Duh, scale and sweep don't show up with a white background... Have to use more ink and make the background at least gray. Who's working upstairs in the software dept.?
              The first sentence is bang on.

              "just because you don't have a lot people complaining doesn't mean they're all happy out there."

              Most people recognize the futility of trying to tell a large corporation that they need to listen to their customers and so, just quietly look elsewhere.


              "Who does the programming people get their direction from?"

              It's almost silly but it's by COMMITEE-!! ROFLMAO


              "Don't need scroll "

              I'll disagree with you here......The ULTRA jumps a whole page down when you want to look at the next pid that is in sequence and is directly related to the current page. Ya can't look at two consecutive pids that are pertinent to each other because of this page jump.


              "need to be printer friendly"

              OK, I'll agree here if you want to print directly from the machine.

              At least there is the option of using SSC (Shop Stream Connect) and the backgrounds and trace colours, etc, can be changed and manipulated there.
              It's another process to save the files to another computer perhaps but it's how I, and others, save files so they can be categorized AND FOUND LATER.


              "need better graphing"

              While the graphing is really very good, it could be better if they standardized the number of data points the machines collect in one second.
              In some cases the machines start saving as many as 32 data points per second and then degrade to less than one data point per second-!
              At that point it's not even a phone app, it's a Comodore-64-!!!


              You've brought up some very good issues that the corporate giant needs to listen to.

              They need to CORRECT PREVIOUS ERRORS AGGRESSIVELY, rather than BLITHELY FORGING AHEAD with what THEY WANT because it's too much effort to go back and actually fix things.

              When we, on the bench, make mistakes, we most assuredly have to go back and make corrections. It's better to make those corrections BEFORE the mistakes get out the door-!!
              Releasing known errors out the door can never, under any circumstances, be condoned or justified.

              I'm glad they have gone back in some instances and corrected things but including the appropriate pids in the datastream really shouldn't have taken FIVE YEARS-! Version 13.2 now is showing a lot of improvement in this area.

              Yes the wheels turn at a slow grind, EXCEPT where THEY want to splash out something "New and Improved"

              Comment

              • Wheel
                Senior Member
                • Jul 2007
                • 719

                #8
                Originally posted by Crusty
                The first sentence is bang on.

                "just because you don't have a lot people complaining doesn't mean they're all happy out there."

                Most people recognize the futility of trying to tell a large corporation that they need to listen to their customers and so, just quietly look elsewhere.

                I think this may be happening - the forums here don't seem as active as they used to be. I think some are starting to give up and look elsewhere, and elsewhere is starting to have more to offer - some of which we've been asking Snap on for until we're blue in the face.

                "Who does the programming people get their direction from?"

                It's almost silly but it's by COMMITEE-!! ROFLMAO

                That speaks for itself


                "Don't need scroll "

                I'll disagree with you here......The ULTRA jumps a whole page down when you want to look at the next pid that is in sequence and is directly related to the current page. Ya can't look at two consecutive pids that are pertinent to each other because of this page jump.


                "need to be printer friendly"

                OK, I'll agree here if you want to print directly from the machine.

                At least there is the option of using SSC (Shop Stream Connect) and the backgrounds and trace colours, etc, can be changed and manipulated there.
                It's another process to save the files to another computer perhaps but it's how I, and others, save files so they can be categorized AND FOUND LATER.


                "need better graphing"

                While the graphing is really very good, it could be better if they standardized the number of data points the machines collect in one second.
                In some cases the machines start saving as many as 32 data points per second and then degrade to less than one data point per second-!
                At that point it's not even a phone app, it's a Comodore-64-!!!


                You've brought up some very good issues that the corporate giant needs to listen to.

                They need to CORRECT PREVIOUS ERRORS AGGRESSIVELY, rather than BLITHELY FORGING AHEAD with what THEY WANT because it's too much effort to go back and actually fix things.

                When this happens to us in our shops it's called a "comeback".
                You have a customer pay job and a comeback roll in. Anyone care to guess which one you get to work on first ???
                Snap On had a "comeback" with Atlas they haven't fixed yet when they took away a host of features we valued greatly. OTC never fixed their "comeback" with the Genisys scope netting them a lot of ill will that they have yet to recover from. Snap On is repeating OTC's mistake.


                When we, on the bench, make mistakes, we most assuredly have to go back and make corrections. It's better to make those corrections BEFORE the mistakes get out the door-!!
                Releasing known errors out the door can never, under any circumstances, be condoned or justified.

                Ditto that. One thing I think would help and would like to see is the ability to have several versions (10.2, 11.4, 13.2 for example)
                coexist on the tool at the same time instead of the new version automatically replacing the older version. I feel they could at least do this on Verus and Verdict if nothing else. When there was the inevitable
                screw up, the mechanic could at least go back to the version of software he had that worked and get busy.


                I'm glad they have gone back in some instances and corrected things but including the appropriate pids in the datastream really shouldn't have taken FIVE YEARS-! Version 13.2 now is showing a lot of improvement in this area.

                Yes the wheels turn at a slow grind, EXCEPT where THEY want to splash out something "New and Improved"
                new and improved is all too often only descriptive of the price.
                You can expect the reputation of your business to be no better than the cheapest item or service you are willing to sell. - Wheel

                Comment

                • tomtec
                  Member
                  • Jun 2013
                  • 43

                  #9
                  i want 10.2 back

                  I agree I was very disappointed when s-o took out the rpm control and replaced it a misfire test !!!!! it was in my 9.2 but not in 13.2!!!! can anyone try to find in there modis ? it was in function test menu I was told by a ex s/w person and I was told this is the first he ever heard s-o taking something out and not adding to it!!!!

                  Comment

                  • tomtec
                    Member
                    • Jun 2013
                    • 43

                    #10
                    10.2 back

                    Originally posted by Wheel
                    new and improved is all too often only descriptive of the price.
                    I like crustys idea on multiple versions installed and the person or we all send videos on what it use to be !!!!! that might wake them up!!!!

                    Comment

                    • Crusty
                      Senior Member
                      • Dec 2007
                      • 2450

                      #11
                      Originally posted by tomtec
                      I like crustys idea on multiple versions installed and the person or we all send videos on what it use to be !!!!! that might wake them up!!!!
                      Multiple software versions is actually Wheels' idea. It is a good one. New features is all well and good but when something doesn't work right it can cost us dearly on the bench.
                      Being able to revert back to when a function wasn't broken allows us to continue working repairing vehicles instead of stalling us in our tracks.

                      It probably wouldn't work on smaller platforms but a laptop or tablet based tool should certainly have the capability of storing a previous version.

                      Comment

                      • Wheel
                        Senior Member
                        • Jul 2007
                        • 719

                        #12
                        Originally posted by tomtec
                        I agree I was very disappointed when s-o took out the rpm control and replaced it a misfire test !!!!! it was in my 9.2 but not in 13.2!!!! can anyone try to find in there modis ? it was in function test menu I was told by a ex s/w person and I was told this is the first he ever heard s-o taking something out and not adding to it!!!!
                        Snap On seems to have gotten into a nasty little habit of giving a good feature in its tools and then taking it away and not returning it. This is not only bad business, but outright wrong.

                        For instance:
                        Heritage Vantage could graph ohms. They FINALLY gave that feature to the vantage Pro, but to none of their other scopes.
                        Heritage Vantage could also graph RPM, and as far as I know, none of their other tools can.
                        Then there was the loss of a ton of good features when they brought out Atlas for the Verus.

                        If Snap On is going to take away features from a tool and not return them, then they at least owe their customers an explanation why.
                        After all, we the customers are the ones who have to LIVE with the results and consequences of these decisions on a DAILY basis whereas
                        the designers and builders of these tools can just walk away and
                        start designing the next tool.
                        You can expect the reputation of your business to be no better than the cheapest item or service you are willing to sell. - Wheel

                        Comment

                        • Wheel
                          Senior Member
                          • Jul 2007
                          • 719

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Crusty
                          Multiple software versions is actually Wheels' idea. It is a good one. New features is all well and good but when something doesn't work right it can cost us dearly on the bench.
                          Being able to revert back to when a function wasn't broken allows us to continue working repairing vehicles instead of stalling us in our tracks.

                          It probably wouldn't work on smaller platforms but a laptop or tablet based tool should certainly have the capability of storing a previous version.
                          It would work on Verus or Verdict, and such a perk would definitely be a strong incentive for one to cough up the extra money for one of these.

                          I would be willing to upgrade to 13.2 TODAY if it could coexist with 10.2 on my Verus and I could easily access either quickly.
                          I'm not holding my breath, though.
                          You can expect the reputation of your business to be no better than the cheapest item or service you are willing to sell. - Wheel

                          Comment

                          • Wheel
                            Senior Member
                            • Jul 2007
                            • 719

                            #14
                            another plug for multiple software versions

                            I was just thinking today how being able to have multiple software versions on the Verus might be able to fix another annoying issue.

                            Many Verus owners bought the Verus because of the promise or potential of running and viewing scanner and scope simultaneously only to be disappointed when all you could view simultaneously was the 2 channel component tester - and then only after an obscure, clunky, very UNuser-friendly procedure.

                            Here's the idea - IF Snap On could and would make it possible for multiple versions of the software to coexist on the tool, and IF you could pull up 2 of them on the tool at the same time, then what would stop you from using the newest version's scanner software, and the scope software from, say last year's version, thus giving you at least a workaround allowing simultaneous viewing of scanner and the FULL FEATURED 4 channel scope - and it would be a straightforward process?
                            You can expect the reputation of your business to be no better than the cheapest item or service you are willing to sell. - Wheel

                            Comment

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