11.4 DUE OUT Monday

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  • USpMD
    Senior Member
    • Oct 2010
    • 171

    11.4 DUE OUT Monday

    Anyone heard whats comming with 11.4 as yet, Im holding off from buying some other tools waiting to see if Snap-on has heard our requests, need to tool that will do chrysler pinion factor in TCM, also Honda OCS reset
    "I wanna help the helpless, but I could careless about the clueless". Dennis Miller
  • USpMD
    Senior Member
    • Oct 2010
    • 171

    #2
    Whats uo Snap=on

    Wow, this post has been up for 6 or 7 hours, no one fron Snap-on has replied, Ok dose this mean Im mistaken? 11.4 wont be out in three days, or dose this mean 11.4 has no marketable features worth spending $1249 for?, Ive been told in past posts snap on dosent preanounce these updates unless its within 30 days of release, well we are beound that Whats up Snap-on?? Is this new update worth the price tag?
    "I wanna help the helpless, but I could careless about the clueless". Dennis Miller

    Comment

    • Bob's Garage
      Senior Member
      • Nov 2007
      • 3257

      #3
      11.4 fixes

      As far as new coverage, a lot of stuff some backfilling and some new stuff, too much to mention. You know how it is, you don't know if it's there till you plug in.

      The best thing in my mind, is that we have more control over the graphing. No chance of accidently popping graphs open accidently and a feature ("Graph All") that allows a custom data list 16 PIDs or less to open all PIDs in graphs with one button. Saves a lot of time.

      Thanks, Bob
      Last edited by Bob's Garage; 09-30-2011, 08:53 PM.

      Comment

      • USpMD
        Senior Member
        • Oct 2010
        • 171

        #4
        [QUOTE=Bob's Garage;26571][SIZE="3"][COLOR="DarkSlateGray"]As far as new coverage, a lot of stuff some backfilling and some new stuff, too much to mention. You know how it is, you don't know if it's there till you plug in.

        "The best thing in my mind, is that we have more control over the graphing. No chance of accidently popping graphs open accidently and a feature ("Graph All") that allows a custom data list 16 PIDs or less to open all PIDs in graphs with one button. Saves a lot of time."
        Thanks Bob. for your input

        So there going to charge us for this? sounds like it should be free right?
        Quote"You know how it is, you don't know if it's there till you plug in." so true, I called support once again today, stated I have a client with a 1992 Dodge spirt, 3.0l v6, wants me to install TCM program, so since I have been burent before, I call snap-on to find out if I can (flash file is not a problem with J2534 for TCM) correct or adjust pinion factor, they state not supported, I have to buy a DRB III that is outdated to do this, even thou at snap-on we support it on some modules or vehicles, just not this one!!
        What gives here?? Bob I dont want to beat on your door, but you state you have and I quote"Diagnostic Tool(s):
        Modis Liberator, Modis Avenger, Solus, Solus Pro, Solus Ultra, Ethos, Verus, Verdict, Vantage Pro, " what is it?? do you have that much money to waste, or has Snap-on bought you?? Why would you need this much overlapping coverage from the scan tools you state you have bought?? Sorry guys, as Ive stated before I call it as I see it, this seems extraordinarily unsual right?? So Snap-on, whats new, and why should I pony up $1249 to pay for as Crusty states(and I mean this in the kindest way Crusty) updates for missing pids, controls and lapeses in coverage, give me something I can expand my business with as I have trusted you with in the past, if you look out for me!! I will look out for you$$$
        "I wanna help the helpless, but I could careless about the clueless". Dennis Miller

        Comment

        • Bob's Garage
          Senior Member
          • Nov 2007
          • 3257

          #5
          "So there going to charge us for this? sounds like it should be free right?"

          Well, don't you get at least one free update? Yeah, I know. The graphing hasn't been right since 10.2. But, it is better. As soon as we can move the graphs from side to side, by dropping and dragging, then, we will be where we need to be.

          The problem is, so many losers out there don't even know the value of graphing, let alone a custom data list. Thats about 80% of scanner users. For them, The Verus is a big code reader.When I complained after 10.4 and the departure from 10.2 type of graphing flexibility, I was told that the regular users haven't complained, it was only the "power users" that have issues. Therefore, graphing only gets partial priority for fixing.


          "Bob I dont want to beat on your door, but you state you have and I quote"Diagnostic Tool(s):
          Modis Liberator, Modis Avenger, Solus, Solus Pro, Solus Ultra, Ethos, Verus, Verdict, Vantage Pro, " what is it?? do you have that much money to waste, or has Snap-on bought you?? Why would you need this much overlapping coverage from the scan tools you state you have bought?? Sorry guys, as Ive stated before I call it as I see it, this seems extraordinarily unsual right?? "


          The tools listed are because I am involved in the "Internal Forums" for beta I could de-list them, but for test purposes, it is easier for the different developers to know who has what. I paid for some of the tools but testing has some benefit. When SO needs me to test an SSC delivered scanner "patch" I can do it. If there is a new beta version of software, I can test it, thats all. I use all of the tools, but I prefer Verus Wireless and Solus Ultra.

          So Snap-on, whats new, and why should I pony up $1249 to pay for as Crusty states(and I mean this in the kindest way Crusty) updates for missing pids, controls and lapeses in coverage, give me something I can expand my business with as I have trusted you with in the past, if you look out for me!! I will look out for you$$$

          The way I have found to get missing PIDs added is to compare tools. The best way I found is to take screenshots from other tools and post them. I have done this with the Tech2 and got the FF sensor PID added to some GM Flex Fuel vehicles in data. I asked tor VSS, IAT and Evap_Eval PIDs to be added to the Ford Evap Cold Soak Time Bypass Functional Test, and it was. Intellegent requests with examples seem to make things happen at SO.

          Again, the problem may be that the "power users" are the only ones that may complain about coverage. The "code readers" (80%) are happy with the coverage. As I see it, as time goes on, SO does do a better job on newer vehicles as far as coverage on models and systems. The problem is that these vehicles haven't found thier way into my shop yet. It is the older vehicles that we are seeing right? 2005 and back. I still see a few 1995 and older junks. What about California and the non rust belt states? they have ton of pre OBD2 vehicles. At least in Illinois they die off in 20 years or so.

          Comment

          • Crusty
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2007
            • 2450

            #6
            I see a wide range of model year vehicles from 40 years old up to brand new vehicles where my customers (and they've become friends) RELY on me to service their vehicles and keep them in as good a condition as possible.
            This means it is absolutely impossible for any one person to know what all the pids are that are available at the diagnostic connector.
            With well more than one or two persons creating the SO software, in specific groups, and the resources a company as huge as SnapON has, we RELY on SnapOn to provide us with the CORRECT information. We also pony up and pay for that information. No one purchases any product expecting it to not function.
            While some people get mad at me for expecting a properly functioning product, that is exactly what i fully expect, especially from a company like SnapOn.
            The graphing and data storage capability of the SO equipment is very, very good. However, there are probably some tools that outdo SO in some areas, and I don't expect "perfection" in an imperfect world.
            I DO expect SO to STRIVE for perfection. When they are told, informed, emailed, given photographs, sent OE information, comparisons, PROOFS of incomplete, and therefore innacurate information in their tools or coverage, they should bend over backwards to CORRECT the problem(s) be they missing Pinion Factor (USpMD), or culling out previously available tests (Bob's-Garage), or missing pids, or incorrect scales.
            Unfortunately (for us) they're more concerned with "making a buck" than looking out for our best interests. I understand business is business, but I get affronted by the attitude prevalent in the Ivory Tower Board Room, where salaries are obscene, and correcting past mistakes is so far down the list of priorities that it's not even on their radar-!!
            Once they've been informed of an error or ommision, they can't say they didn't know.
            If someone truly doesn't know of a problem, they can in all honesty say they were not aware.
            Once they've been informed, if they practice the 1/2 truth game, they are guilty of a lie.
            They CHOOSE to spend their resources on "N.E.W." tools and equipment rather than correcting existing issues. They CHOOSE to devote more resources to creating sales instead of "back-filling".
            USpMD, Bob's-Garage, Eddies-Verus, Gentz, Wheel, SnapOn-Kid, and the list goes on. Some guys who are still here on the forums, and some that have left and given up who we don't hear from anymore and are unlikely to even consider another purchase from SO. Each of us have our different priorities and specific issues.
            The COMMON theme is "errors and ommisions"
            HOW the company CHOOSES to deal with EXISTING customers ( us, you and me ) then becomes the core issue.
            Fancy schmancy colours, touch screens, wireless, new tool names, while they grab the attention of some, my priority is the true value and FUNCTIONALITY of the tool, be it a wrench, screwdriver or a scan tool or labscope.
            While there are SOME at SO who Give-A-SxxT, like Jay G, SKIP, and Pat over at Ask-A-Tech (to name some but certainly not all), there are far too few of their kind.
            Making us PAY for something that should have been there in the first place, or not even correcting the problem at all is what makes me "CRUSTY"
            Letting us know they have corrected an issue, or at least acknowledging that something needs to be fixed, AND WILL BE-!! would certainly go a long way to easing the entire "tone" of posts here and elsewhere.
            Sorry for the "blathering"....JMHO and to borrow an expression from IATN, "Flame Suit On"....LOL

            Comment

            • USpMD
              Senior Member
              • Oct 2010
              • 171

              #7
              Quote;(from Bob)" Again, the problem may be that the "power users" are the only ones that may complain about coverage. The "code readers" (80%) are happy with the coverage. As I see it, as time goes on, SO does do a better job on newer vehicles as far as coverage on models and systems. The problem is that these vehicles haven't found thier way into my shop yet. It is the older vehicles that we are seeing right? 2005 and back. I still see a few 1995 and older junks. What about California and the non rust belt states? they have ton of pre OBD2 vehicles. At least in Illinois they die off in 20 years or so".


              I suspect this is the most truthful statement I have read here to date, So Snap-On, why would you build a tool such as verus, with so many features, IE; 4 channel lab scope, Component Test Meter , customer record, Scanner and trouble shooter and charge over Nine thousand dollars when your target market only needs a code reader, for vehicles ranging from 2005 to say 1987, It would appear its numbers game right, profits, so what about the other 20% of us? (and dont get me started on the costs of required accessories and updates twice a year, free update... ya right!)
              Remember us! We are the ones who have helped get you where you are today. I worked on three vehicles 2010 and newer just today, yep you guessed it, there was no scanner coverage for most of it, and if its older than say a 1985, I just use a vacuum gauge, test light and whats that other thing... hum.. hum... oh ya! timing light..

              Look, its like this, as I have stated in past posts, these are good tools, have good coverage 80% of the time (there it is again, that number keeps popping up) And I would not have bought it if I did'nt think it was useful, but if you built say: cars! instead of scanners, and your new models came out missing say: seats! Would you charge us to put them in on the next update???

              Bob; this is not in any way pointed in your direction, you like others Jay G, SKIP, and Pat over at Ask-A-Tech (to name some but certainly not all) Thanks Crusty, and many others behind the scenes we dont know by name, I feel do get it.
              Bob, why is the text red, and so big I could read it from two blocks away?

              From my perspective, when I need help and call in, people are pleasent there (1-800-snap-on) But I never get any answers, seems we just dont do that yet, or no coverage, or we are working on it, or I will add it to the list, guess I fall into the 20% catagory
              "I wanna help the helpless, but I could careless about the clueless". Dennis Miller

              Comment

              • jrorl63
                Snap-on DSD
                • Aug 2007
                • 121

                #8
                Originally posted by USpMD
                Wow, this post has been up for 6 or 7 hours, no one fron Snap-on has replied, Ok dose this mean Im mistaken? 11.4 wont be out in three days, or dose this mean 11.4 has no marketable features worth spending $1249 for?, Ive been told in past posts snap on dosent preanounce these updates unless its within 30 days of release, well we are beound that Whats up Snap-on?? Is this new update worth the price tag?
                Here you go http://www1.snapon.com/display/1068/...NAL9272011.pdf

                Comment

                • USpMD
                  Senior Member
                  • Oct 2010
                  • 171

                  #9
                  Thank you jrorl63 for that link
                  "I wanna help the helpless, but I could careless about the clueless". Dennis Miller

                  Comment

                  • greasybob
                    Senior Member
                    • May 2008
                    • 1590

                    #10
                    "POWER USERS" eh ? I like it.

                    Comment

                    • Kronz070
                      Junior Member
                      • Aug 2010
                      • 20

                      #11
                      I've been running the 11.4 software since yesterday (Oct 1) Seems to be stable, as it's only locked up on me once so far.

                      Comment

                      • jrorl63
                        Snap-on DSD
                        • Aug 2007
                        • 121

                        #12
                        Installed 11.4 on my VERUS and found some great improvements over 11.2 (beyond significant vehicle coverage):
                        - Faster Boot times - On (including loading Atlas) = 1 Minute, 55 sec; Off = 30 sec; Atlas load time (from desktop) = 45 sec
                        - Atlas navigation and responsiveness much faster/snappy; touchscreen reacts faster than if I was using a mouse; much easier to use a finger even for small hyper links in Shopkey.
                        - Bluetooth connectivity between Display and S3 Scan Module initializes much faster and is more reliable.
                        - There is no longer a prompt to connect a USB cable to complete the Ford cylinder contribution test; I tested the CCT on a Ford and did not lose connection to the S3 Scan module when I was prompted to turn off the ignition key.
                        - After properly ending a scanner session, by backing out of the menus and selecting change vehicle there isn't the "Scanner communication must be stopped..." prompt. Prompt will come up only if you don't back out properly.
                        - Scanner Data display is greatly improved - Up to 26 PIDs displayed in Text view; Up to 16 PIDs in Graph View; Ability to scroll through PID lists with fingers (anywhere on screen) without accidentely causing the PID to change to graph; New graph view and list view shortcuts for faster set up of data display including custom data list; Improved/bolder text display in data list.
                        - Save collected data (movies/screenshots) nearly instantly.
                        - Imbedded User's manuals load faster and are much more user friendly. I.E. I was able to go from data display to find a PID defintion in the applicable user manual within a matter of seconds, with my finger.
                        - Troubleshooter references load faster and are now accessed with a button, instead of a small hyperlink (again, using my finger)
                        - I was able to load several troubleshooter code tips without being connected to the vehicle on Fords & GM (not the case for Chrysler).
                        - New customizations for Vehicle History and records
                        - Annoying virtual keyboard no longer pops up automatically, unless you specifically tap on a entry field or press the keyboard button.
                        - CTM and meter loads faster; not sure if this new for CTM but I noticed I could save configurations.
                        - There are shortcuts to print what your looking at, throughout the different Atlas modules.
                        - In the past when I ran into a problem such as abruptly loosing communications with the vehicle/Atlas error message, I usually would need to reset/power cycle the S3 Scan module, and restart the Atlas software to reestablish bluetooth connectivity. I tried navigating out (using the change vehicle button) from the scanner codes screen without properly backing out with the back button, crashed the Atlas program then restarted Atlas (45 sec) and never needed to power cycle the S3 scan module.
                        - The only issue I ran into that could be considered a problem was navigating back and forth between the Scanner code menu and Information (Shopkey5.com). After more than three consecutive attempts (scanner code list to information) I received an Access Denied message. The workaround for this issue is selecting log-out before navigating out of information, just like it is on desktop log-ins.
                        It appears that Snap-on implemented alot of VERUS/VERDICT customer requests in 11.4. Good Job!!!

                        Comment

                        • sbreland73
                          Senior Member
                          • Jan 2009
                          • 1076

                          #13
                          Yes, thanks for sharing!
                          Last edited by sbreland73; 10-31-2011, 09:05 PM.
                          S. Breland

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