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Local tire shop is putting a bad taste in everyone's mouth recently. I normally don't do anything related to tires but customers are wanting their lights shut off more and more. Any suggestions on good entry level TPMS tool that will make recalibration process after tire rotation easier? I watched tire guys a while back take their hand held device and hold it next to valve stem and relearn tire location in less than one minute. I forgot what brand he said it was. Any suggestions?
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No free air? Why would anyone be putting their damn lips to The Michelin Man's valve stem?Local tire shop is putting a bad taste in everyone's mouth recently.
Autistic color screened 408 is the replacement to the old 401
Last edited by Witsend; 06-12-2017, 06:48 AM. -
Will the 401 allow you to relearn tire location, after rotation, on GM without venting or inflating tire pressure???Comment
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I have a OTC 3834,works good.Around here no one charges much,and most times nothing to reset tire monitors,it's just another cost of doing business.
If your local tire shop is getting away with charging for it,good for them.Comment
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I believe so , but you still might have to initiate the relearn sequence from the menu and select buttons on the dash. On other cars you need to retrieve the hex codes with the 401 and then change the ID positions using a scanner. Often I write the hex codes next to the valve stems with a Sharpy marker so next time I don't even need to excite the sensor to retrieve the IDs, and they are already in the TPMS module but positions edited. It would be nice not to enter all the hex numbers , just delete the position abbreviations and renter LF RF RR LR in front of the hex code.Will the 401 allow you to relearn tire location, after rotation, on GM without venting or inflating tire pressure???
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I generally no longer mess with my TPMS tool unless the TPMS light is on for some reason or I need to test if a garage remote or key fob remote button generates a RKE signal.Comment
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I use the snap on tpms3. Works great.Comment
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Some manufacturers (Ford for example) use a sensor that is strapped to the rim recess area with a long strap and the sensor is located opposite the valve stem. Most I believe that used to use this type of sensor location may have transitioned to the more standard sensor located at the valve stem. Just something to be aware of if a sensor doesn't excite when you hold the tool beside the valve stem.Comment
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TPMS is getting interesting and is starting to become more of a maintenance headache due to the age of the original sensors and the batteries starting to get low and die in the sensors.
So here are a few key issues to consider and think about.
1. Batteries in the active TPMS sensors are lasting between 7-12 years typically depending on how often the car is driven and where the car is located. Average battery life is probably around 9-10 years.
2. As the batteries start to age and get low, you will start to see intermittent TPMS problems depending on the system. Often the problems show up during the Winter months due to the temperatures dropping and the battery Voltage is directly related to the ambient temperature because batteries are chemical devices. Lower temperature, lower Voltage/available output of the battery.
3. TPMS sensors start to trigger in the Fall months where I am located. Once the outside temps get below 40F, you will start to see everyone pull up to get air in their tires. Keep in mind for every change in 10F temperature there will be a 1 PSI change in the tire pressure typically.
4. A TPMS tool is really a REQUIRED tool these days, even if you are just using it for your personal vehicles. I got a great deal on a Autel TS401 for like $73 on my doorstep about a year ago, did not really need it, but figured for $73, it it was worth adding to my set of tools.
5. You still should have a good scan tool like the Solus Ultra or a newer, higher end scan tool to be able to actually communicate with the TPMS module, check and clear TPMS codes and activate the TPMS leaning procedure. There are some more expensive TPMS tools that do connect to the OBDII port and give you more features, but why do this when many of us already have a Pro level scan tool.
6. MANY TPMS sensors are due for replacement due to battery age, and there will be MANY, MANY more coming our way over the next few years. So without a TPMS tool and/or Pro level scanner you are in the dark and may need to send customers somewhere else to have their TPMS systems maintained.
7. Believe it or not, Costco is the largest Retailer of TPMS sensors in the US! They tend to charge about $45-$50 per wheel to install and program replacement TPMS sensors. But I have had problems where some of the Costco shops do not have a working or updated tool. They use the Shreader TPMS sensors and tools.
8. If you need to get into programming sensors, Autel has universal sensors and a programming interface that connects via USB to a computer. I thing the programming interface is pretty cheap, around $75 as I recall and their Universal sensors are pretty reasonable.
9. Not clearing codes in the TPMS module can be dangerous. I was working on a 13 year old low mileage Subaru that had intermittent TPMS errors for a friend of mine. Found there were 2 sensors reporting low battery. Told her to take it to Costco. They replaced all 4 TPMS sensors, but screwed up and did not program them and did not clear codes from the TPMS module. I decided to grab my Solus Ultra and my Autel TS401 and see what was going on. Turned out the original 2 low battery errors were still in the TPMS module along with all 4 of the original sensors showing as not reporting. Costco did not properly program the new sensors.
About 5 minutes to put the TPMS system in Learn mode with the Solus Ultra, trigger each wheel sensors with my Autel TS401, then clear the history codes in the TPMS system and all was good.
I use my TS401 tool all the time to check the tires in my personal cars, quicker than screwing around with a gauge and I pay attention to pressure differences because this may mean I have a slow leak in a tire.
While not every shop wants to deal with TPMS sensors, there will be a lot more of these issues showing up very soon due to the aging fleet of existing sensors. While there may not be a lot of profit in dealing with sensor and TPMS system issues, it will be a very useful thing to have a TPMS tool even if your shop does very little, if any tire wore. I cannot tell you the times I had tires rotated at Costco on my personal vehicles and asked if the new tire positions were re-learned in the TPMS system and I was told their tool was not working! I call BS on this and this was just the Costco store being lazy. Some vehicles self learn the tire position, some require the sensors to be triggered while the system is in a Learn mode.
Active TPMS systems are here to stay. Some manufacturers went back to Passive TPMS systems using wheel speed sensors, but the US Government has mandated that the Active TPMS systems will be required as the new standard in the next few years and the Passive TPMS systems are out.Comment
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Thank you JamesO. I ordered the 401. I figure for $139 I can't get hurt too bad. Being a small shop located in a rural area, I end up doing a little bit of everything car related. I am seeing more and more TPMS lights on in my customers cars when they bring them in for unrelated repairs. Everyone's info is greatly appreciated. Thank you.Comment
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I have been very happy with my TS401. It can trigger and read the sensor data. Some sensors provide battery Voltage, installation/build date and other useful info, some have less info. The TS401 can trigger the sensors and also test wireless keyfobs as well. The TS401 is also updateable over the Internet, I have updated mine a few times and there is no cost.
Autel also has the TPMS Pad which is use to program the universal Autel TPMS MX universal sensors. The Autel TPMS sensors are typically around $28 each and can be found on ebay for a set of 4 for around $100.
This package from NewEgg is not a bad price for 4 sensors and the TPMS Pad.
https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...aAiG78P8HAQ100.
The Autel TPMS pad is only around $50-$75 depending on the source, example of some sources:
I have also purchased AC Delco TPMS sensor for my 2005 GMC Yukon which had the batteries starting to go in a few sensors around year 10. I think I paid around $32 each for these on Amazon. ALWAYS get the TPMS nut kits as over the years the jam nuts corrode and seize on the sensors.
So for the cost of the sensors it is not a bad idea to stock 2-4 sensors in the shop with new jam nuts, have a programmer and a tool then you can quickly sort out problems without delays. More and more of TPMS system problems are on the way. Many states require functional TPMS systems for safety inspection.
The problem is you need to be realistic about all of this. If the car is over 8-10 years old and has a sensor with a weak battery, the other sensors have a limited lifespan. While it may be cheaper to replace the single sensor, then the customer may be annoyed by the other 3 sensors in the near future. It is not a cheap proposition for customer to replace all 4 sensors due to the sensor cost, tire removal, sensor replacement and balancing. But sometimes it is best to solve the problem for the next 10 years!
$200+ is a lot of money for some people to replace 4 TPMS sensors, but there is are legal and safety concerns that need to be considered along with safety inspection requirements in some states.
In more rural areas, having a working TPMS system might be very helpful and even save someone's life. But it also means few shops are prepared and experienced in dealing with these systems.
I think Costco exclusively uses the Schrader brand of sensors and tools. I believe the universal sensors can limit the stocking to a few as 2-4 sensor part numbers. There may be a few outliers that have very specialized sensors, but the programmable universal sensors will cover quite a vast amount of applications.
What gets me is we are 10+ years into Active TPMS monitoring systems and people have yet to get a good handle on these systems. Often it would be wise to sell replacement sensors at the time of tire installation to hopefully save the customer a few dollars. But again, 4 tires for some people is very painful, much less another $125-$200 on top of 4 tires.
Anyway, I hope some of this info will be useful for members here, not everyone has dealt with TPMS problems or very familiar with them.
Some other useful info:
Last edited by JamesO; 06-13-2017, 07:09 AM.Comment
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TPMS position relearn a Hassle with many procedures
Trying to simplify and not having to waste 15minutes finding out it don't work the same with every car.
Hate spending time accessing TPMS and then not finding a clear cut menu option on the scan tool to change the TPMS sensor positions on all the car makes.
"And I still haven't found what I'm looking for" (U2)
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Over here in the UK the latest designs of TPMS have a pressure sensor glued to the central area of the inner tyre, thus the valve at the rim becomes a standard valve.Comment
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Often when you rotate tires on cars with TPMS systems, you can put the car in the TPMS "Learn" mode and then use the TPMS tool to trigger each sensor, usually starting at the drivers side front tire then working clockwise around the car.
Many cars can be put into the TPMS "Learn" mode without special tools and often you will get a horn and parking light flash as feedback that a sensor has been read. Some cars you will need to use a Profession level scan tool to put the car in "Learn" mode and some cars have a button or menu to put the car in "Learn" mode.
Some cars like a few of my BMW's will automatically resolve where the tires are located by the signal level and other factors.
I often check the tires in many of my cars with my Autel TS401 rather that even getting a tire gauge out.Comment
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I wonder how many Hillbilly Truckers have tried putting R134 in a flat tire?
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